Why I`m not that moved by Mufasa`s death.

[Annie]

What about Brother Bear? Koda's Dad is never mentioned and it's obvious he's heart broken when Kenai tells him the truth about his mother.
Spirit never had his father mentioned (Except for saying he took his herd from him)
Po's REAL parents seem to be equally important (Although his mother is pictured more)
In Aristocats they don't have a father, but a mother who clearly loves them.

Perhaps they did it because the image of a mother dying IS more upsetting than a father, because the maternal bond seems to be stronger than the paternal (Not always, but a larger percentage of the time)

Don't forget Zira is a mother and is killed.

[DGFone]

I wish I had a very elegant response, but I don't.

The Lion King's source material is Shakespeare's Hamlet. There, the father dies. So in The Lion King, the father also dies. End of story.

[Misiziri]

[quote="Annie"]What about Brother Bear? Koda's Dad is never mentioned and it's obvious he's heart broken when Kenai tells him the truth about his mother.
Spirit never had his father mentioned (Except for saying he took his herd from him)
Po's REAL parents seem to be equally important (Although his mother is pictured more)
In Aristocats they don't have a father, but a mother who clearly loves them.

Perhaps they did it because the image of a mother dying IS more upsetting than a father, because the maternal bond seems to be stronger than the paternal (Not always, but a larger percentage of the time)

Don't forget Zira is a mother and is killed.[/quote]

Spirit's not Disney, nor is Kung-Fu Panda. but I see what you're saying. I think it's the natural procedure for only a mother to raise a horse, and it looks like that movie was at least trying to follow the natural way a horse lives and of course add twists and whatnot.

Brother Bear is an exception to some extent, again I think it's trying to be more realistic. It looked like it was deep winter though, why wasn't that bear hibernating? I also never see any strong movies about sisterhood (although some people don't consider Brother Bear strong or great or anything, so...) Zira's a psychopath, as her human character was portrayed in Romeo and Juliett, I believe. Correct mwah if I'm wrong. She was a villain, therefore she must be dominated by the hero. Not to mention she was a pretty worthless mother. Aristocats is the greatest exception. The mother cat's human is a loving woman, and she's portrayed as a good, loving mother. So you're right about that one.

[Flowertall]

In all fairness, it would be just as bad with any kind of relationship that is at the expense of something. I just wish they could show us a life with both parents, it shouldn`t always be necessary to have one of them killed off or missing to make an interesting story.

[SimbasGuard]

Another Disney movie with a Mother/Daughter theme (at least in part) is Little Mermaid 2: Return to the sea.

Simba's relationship with Sarabi isn't the focus in the movie but he clearly loves her:

When Mufasa got up early to show Simba The Pride Lands, Simba takes the time to go and nuzzle Sarabi's legs

The last threat Scar uses before telling Simba to run away is "What will your mother think?" (Simba is also shaken when Nala asks him That same question years later)

It is to defend Sarabi that Simba first confronts Scar, he also tells Scar "Give me one good reason why I shouldn't rip you apart." He would not have been that angry if he didn't love his mother very much.

The first lioness Simba greets after defeating Scar is his mother.

Another reason the Mother/Son or Mother/Daughter relationship is not focused on is because Disney and the rest Hollywood it seems feels that anything more than hour and a half is too long for an animated movie. So they can't focus on every important relationship in the movie. That is really a shame because Nala real should have had a much bigger part in Lion King 2

[SweetNala]

I agree about how father\son is too overused, but I am still moved by Mufasa death. If they added more scenes about Simba and Sarabi I would like that.
Oh, and in SP, Kiara only directly interacts with her mother twice! Both for less than 5 seconds

[Misiziri]

Yeah, Mufasa's death doesn't move that much anymore because of the sheer number of times I've watched it trying to get screengrabs. But you're right.

[Ophelia]

I agree with all of this. I do wish they had included more scenes involving Sarabi and Simba (though others have mentioned the budget, etc.); I think it would've been very sweet to see the future King with his mother more, having an understanding relationship. I can imagine Sarabi and Mufasa both on Pride Rock with Simba, looking at each other and saying, "Everything the light touches is our kingdom." Sorry, though, I'm getting a little carried away. I'm still moved by Mufasa's death, however, because regardless of undermining other relationships, that does not make it right to ignore the relationship that (some) of us have with our fathers, and it is very sad indeed. That being said, however, I still wish that they wouldn't have excluded Sarabi so much in the film, and I also wish that SP would have been more of a mother/daughter AND father/daughter film. When all goes well in a family, a mother is equally as important as a father; we get life lessons from both of them, and I think that to lessen that relationship is a real crime.

The thing about Bambi, though, is that it's quite obvious how close Bambi is to his mother. Still, though, the films themselves focus more on Bambi/father. That's the big problem. There are exceptions in Disney films, naturally, but too sparse to really be considered equal to the father's role in the majority of films. And there's nothing wrong with falling in love, I think, but everyone's right - mainly, that's the only real goal a female has in her movie. Mulan, though, is different, etc., and again there are exceptions. But when a MALE lead is involved, he has a huge dream and mission and goal and falls in love on the way (sometimes).

[PrincessKiara]

[quote="Flowertall"]Don`t get me wrong, I don`t dislike the character Mufasa in any way. That look and that gesture he gives Zazu that tells him to turn around again is just great.

What I dislike, is how so many movies focus on the father/son relationship, especially when it`s at the expense of for instance mother/son, or mother/daughter. Why isn`t Sarabi in Simba`s Pride, not even mentioned, but Mufasa`s there? Why is it when Kiara and Kovu are watching the stars, she says: "My father and I use to do this all the time", why on earth couldn`t it be "My parents and I use to do this all the time"? Would it be too trivial?

Just look at A goofy movie as well. Why aren`t Peg and Pistol even mentioned, they were both really entertaining characters. Is it just so we can focus on father and son?

A father/son movie that I really like is Kramer vs. Kramer, because it`s much more realistic, and it`s not at the expense of anything. It feels like the boy loves his father and mother equally. Of course I`m sure Simba loved his mother just as much as he loved his father, but that`s not the feeling I get from having watched the movie.

When I see Simba crying next to Mufasa`s corpse, what I feel is the movie makers telling us that the father/son relationship is the most special one. And I very much dislike that. I`m not a heartless person, but that scene just doesn`t move me very much. At least now I`ve explained why.[/quote]

I agree. Well, Mufasas death certainly is moving to me, but I still agree with the point you`re making.

I can understand why the writers of TLK chose to focus on the father/son relationship, considering the story is about prince going to become a king, etc.
But still! It wouldn`t have harmed the movie in any way to eleborate a little more on the relationship between Sarabi and Simba. They do have a couple moments in the movie where they interact, and in my opinion at least it`s clear that Simba loves his parents equally, but perhaps looks up to and admires his father more, wants to be like him.. But I agree with what you said, it`s not right of the writers to make it seem as if the relationship between a father and son is "better" than one between mother and son/daughter.

Also, in SP, Kiara and Nalas relationship is extremly underplayed, and it SERIOUSLY bothers me.

About Sarabi not being in SP: This makes me very sad. I know her voice actor passed away, and I understand the writers didn`t want to cast a new voice for her, but come on! They could have easily made Sarabi appear at the presentation, because none of the characters speak in that scene. Then, later in the movie (f.ex at the next scene when Kiara is heading out to explore the Pride Lands) Simba could have mentioned that his mother had passed away.

Off the top of my head I can only think of two Disney movies where the main characters both parents are alive: Mulan and Hercules. But in both these movies, it`s the main characters relationship with the father that is focused on.
The Little Mermaid II is a great example of a mother/daughter movie. Disney should really make more like that, also movies focusing on a mother/son relationship.

[KingKivuli]

I can understand what your saying about the father/son thing, but it is a strong ideal, the son follows in his fathers pawprints, he has dreams and aspirations that are shatter when mufasa is dead. The way it is set up, the king is dead the true heir 'dead' hope is lost etc BUT they still use sarabi. lionesses are supposed to just bow down to the kings orders or face death, Sarabi clearly only did what she was told otherwise she and the others would be punished or worse, but the fact she eventually stood up to Scar and mentioned he was not as good a king shows true loyalty, and Im pretty sure, hope that either her mate or son were still alive

If TLK was based fully on the mother/son and Sarabi was the one killed, then the story would have most likely just led down a road of a depressed simba and mufasa. There would have been to outcasts shown, no epic battle etc thats just the way lion societies work and you have to remember this is based off Hamlet, and meant to be a subtle fun and entertaining way to get into kids (and some adults) that you cant run from your responsibly or give up on dreams cause your idol is 'gone'

please dont get me wrong I would have loved to see more Sarabi in this, but it was a story of Simba, always has been always will be. If we did see Sarabi im sure we would have seen her as a beacon of hope in the dark times, still standing strong. I try to show that point in my own fanfiction and even in the video im currently making. A specific part saying 'the martyr' I show Sarabi as she is the voice of the old ways who would speak out for them and die for them

Its not often i say this but 'go girl power!' sarabi rules even if she has 1 line or 100, keeping hope alive till her own hopes were forefilled