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View topic - Animal Agriculture & Factory Farms — My Lion King Forum

Animal Agriculture & Factory Farms

What's your stance?

Vegan - I love animals!
2
13%
Carnivore - and don't tell me what to eat!
10
67%
Not sure/undecided
3
20%
 
Total votes : 15

Re: Animal Agriculture & Factory Farms

Postby Tora » November 29th, 2016, 7:19 am

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Re: Animal Agriculture & Factory Farms

Postby Azdgari » October 11th, 2018, 11:32 pm

Hey Gemini--I've been thinking a good bit about climate change and reducing carbon impact and all that jazz recently, even before the recent UN report came out, and I'm curious about your perspective on this. I'm trying to move away from beef/pork to chicken/fish, which I see as a very strong way to not only reduce my footprint personally but to contribute to an economic push away from those sorts of meats.

To clarify that, the thought is that the fewer people consume beef, the lower the demand, and ostensibly those agricultural resources would be devoted to other more sustainable livestock (e.g. chicken/fish). As I type this, I realize this doesn't account for non-food products that come from cows, but I imagine that's definitely a secondary driver of cows as livestock as compared to food. But maybe I'm wrong and you can call me out! Anyway, I figure you can alter supply-side behavior in that way more effectively with food than, say, turning off lights. It's important to turn off lights, but the electric company can't exactly change their behavior much in response.

Anyway--you brought up the fascinating point earlier in this thread on how the distribution (and degradation) of arable land, versus the amount of pastureland, raises serious questions about the sustainability, from a 'feeding-humans' point of view, of a widespread move to vegetarianism. To what extent do you think that conflicts with the oft-cited goal of moving away from livestock-as-food due to their considerable carbon impact? Are there innovations like vertical farming, increasing yield through genetic modification, topsoil restoration, or other techniques that could increase the amount of arable land, or the productivity of available arable land?

I am, as I've said before, not very well educated on agricultural science, and have only 'hobbyist' understanding of climate science. But I'd love to learn more about the intersection between these two fields.
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Re: Animal Agriculture & Factory Farms

Postby DGFone » October 12th, 2018, 12:00 am

Since this topic was brought back up, I recently came across this interesting bit of information:

Currently, the world produces enough food to feed an estimated 10 billion people, i.e. a food surplus. So when you here a question of "how can there be hungry people", it's a question of food distribution, not production. But if all of the current land producing area was converted to using only organic food, the food amount would only feed four billion people, slightly over half the current global population.

Just to throw yet another wrench into the gears.
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Re: Animal Agriculture & Factory Farms

Postby Sigurd » October 12th, 2018, 5:06 pm

I don't eat red meat like pork amd beef because there's a lot of resources that are used to produce that meat. I eat poultry and fish however. As with treatment of animals I do believe that cows and pigs are sentient beings and that is a factor that must be considered, however, I believe feeding humans are more important. If We can treat farm animals well at the same time that is a good thing. Regarding organic food I believe that is an obsolete method, the chemicals we use are most cases harmless and non-organic food means higher yields. There are probably some chemicals out there who are really bad that should be banned but then it must be proved by science that it is bad.
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Re: Animal Agriculture & Factory Farms

Postby epxriri » January 3rd, 2019, 5:12 pm

I am a vegetarian, that's my choice. Modern conditions allow living without meat. Sometimes I really scared about the things we make with our own planet... We kill animals, we cut forests, we have polluted the ocean... We have to stop it somehow, there's no choice. I really care about the environment and I stopped using plastic bags and bottles. I even started using a bamboo toothbrush to reduce the usage of plastic. Maybe it's silly but at least something...
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Re: Animal Agriculture & Factory Farms

Postby Regulus » January 4th, 2019, 2:31 am

There are a few things that I find that rarely get considered in this topic:

Yes, humans are supposed to eat meat. It's not culture; it's biology. Throughout human history, most--if not all--humans have consumed any kind of meat that has been available. Name even just one culture that avoided eating meat of any kind, and there might be some reason to suspect it was just a bad habit that we adopted. But it's not. We evolved to eat meat. That's the end of the story.

Farming only vegetables is often said to be a more efficient way of feeding the human population... except no, it's not. Calorie for calorie, meat can be as efficient, if not more efficient than a purely vegetable based diet. It's true that it takes fewer resources to make a pound of beans compared to a pound of beef--but that beef contains way more calories and way more nutrients.

I have heard vegans say that our meat consumption is the main cause of climate change. Except, again, this is just simply wrong. Agriculture, in total, accounts for only around 10% of our total greenhouse gas emissions. It's a very, very small amount in the grand scheme of things. And sure, you could say that methane is a worse greenhouse gas than carbon dioxide is... and that's not necessarily wrong. But methane is only in the atmosphere for 10 years, compared to the 100 or more of carbon dioxide. The long term effects are different. You can't compare eating more bananas and broccoli to driving a Prius.

Furthermore, as DGFone pointed out, organic farming isn't sustainable. If we all agree to only buy organic, there will not be enough food for everyone. GMOs and factory farming allow us to produce more food than we really need--which should be a good thing. It is devastating to the environment, but that's really more of a result of the politics of it rather than the science itself.

I'd also like to end this by saying that meat isn't even unhealthy. Humans have been eating meat for tens, if not hundreds of thousands of years. Those who lived in early human civilizations didn't opt for low fat diets or organic veggie taco burgers over a nice grilled steak. Ancient humans ate animals, and they ate or used every part of the animal, including the fat, feet, and organs.

Of course you can always argue that factory farming is unethical--and it clearly is--but don't we have bigger problems too? What about that T-shirt you're wearing that was made by child slaves in Vietnam? Or, what about the iPhone you're using that was assembled by poor-ass workers in Taiwan who would be happy to make more than 10 cents in a day? To me, factory farming is one of those things that we just have to ignore for now. Not because it isn't wrong, but because thinking about it makes you realize how depressing the world really is. There are so many injustices we should be worry about, but it's out of sight and out of mind for the most part.
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Re: Animal Agriculture & Factory Farms

Postby Azdgari » January 4th, 2019, 5:57 am

[/spoiler]
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Re: Animal Agriculture & Factory Farms

Postby Regulus » January 5th, 2019, 9:50 pm

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Re: Animal Agriculture & Factory Farms

Postby Ultra Fox » January 29th, 2020, 3:26 am

moar factory means moar yums
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