Election Day 2012

[Woeler]

[quote="TheLionPrince"]Well, not one incumbent president since FDR has re-elected with over 7.2% unemployment. Unemployment in the United States is currently at 8.3%. It'll take a miracle for Obama to get re-elected.[/quote]
A rather unrealistic claim, since Obama is still ahead of Romney

[Tora]

Its actually at 8.2% and Romney really shows no promise of Jobs; so regardless I foresee an Obama victory.

[Azdgari]

Hummmmm.

[TheLionPrince]

[quote="Woeler1"][quote="TheLionPrince"]Well, not one incumbent president since FDR has re-elected with over 7.2% unemployment. Unemployment in the United States is currently at 8.3%. It'll take a miracle for Obama to get re-elected.[/quote]
A rather unrealistic claim, since Obama is still ahead of Romney[/quote]

Well, it depends on which presidential poll you are referring to. Here's a list of all the lasted polls tallied in the last few days: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/latest_polls/ Some of these polls whether national or state show Romney over Obama, vice versa, or tied. Not to mention, various polls by different demographics: white, black, Latino, old, young, men, women, and so on. Those polls are bound to have different results.

[quote="Azdgari"]On what grounds do you support Romney?[/quote]

Tax reform, oil expansion, less goverment regulation of the economy, trading policies, gay marriage, support for Israel, and lower the national deficit.

Don't support with him on invading Iran and wanting to overturn Roe v. Wade

Not sure on his stance on health care

[Woeler]

[quote="TheLionPrince"]oil expansion[/quote]
You guys never get enough of that, do you?
[quote="TheLionPrince"] less goverment regulation of the economy[/quote]
Yes, we are suffering from a HUGE crisis and we should give the economy to the people. Don't really think that will turn out good...
[quote="TheLionPrince"]gay marriage[/quote]
I don't even see what or who gives politicians (or anyone else) the right to deny gay people love, happiness and marriage. We're not living in the 14th century anymore. I can see how people can be against abortion, and maybe euthanasia, but this is just plain discrimination.
[quote="TheLionPrince"]support for Israel[/quote]
hmmm, yeah, how about using that money on a decent healthcare system? Is it really worth two countries fighting over who has a better friend in the sky?

I see that they are really, really close in numbers. This is going to be a really, really interesting election. I'm sure as hell gonna stay up that night! (European timezones lol)

[TheLionPrince]

[quote="Woeler1"][quote="TheLionPrince"]oil expansion[/quote]
You guys never get enough of that, do you?[/quote]

LOL! To be more specific, the TransCanada's Keystone XL pipeline. Obama vowed to stop America's reliance on foreign oil during the 2008 election, yet he postponed drilling here for whatever reason he had.

[quote="Woeler1"][quote="TheLionPrince"] less goverment regulation of the economy[/quote]
Yes, we are suffering from a HUGE crisis and we should give the economy to the people. Don't really think that will turn out good...[/quote]

Well, from what I've read on this website, Obama's regulations are killing jobs.

[quote="Woeler1"][quote="TheLionPrince"]gay marriage[/quote]
I don't even see what or who gives politicians (or anyone else) the right to deny gay people love, happiness and marriage. We're not living in the 14th century anymore. I can see how people can be against abortion, and maybe euthanasia, but this is just plain discrimination.[/quote]

I said it before, and I'll say it again. 30 out of 50 states in the U.S. turned it down, voted on by politicians gays and gay marriage-supporting heterosexuals voted into office. People turned out in droves in support of Chick-a-Fil, when various mayors were preventing their establishment in their respective cities.

But, if it makes you happy, Congress overturned the Defense of Marriage Act, and gays can serve openly in the army.

[quote="Woeler1"][quote="TheLionPrince"]support for Israel[/quote]
hmmm, yeah, how about using that money on a decent healthcare system? Is it really worth two countries fighting over who has a better friend in the sky?

I see that they are really, really close in numbers. This is going to be a really, really interesting election. I'm sure as hell gonna stay up that night! (European timezones lol)[/quote]

I do support a decent health care system. And considering Iran developing nuclear weapons to create hostile genocide of Israeli Jews, it is worth supporting Israel. Though, starting a war with Iran, which I don't support, will do more harm than good, and is not the answer.

And yes, this election results are very tight! It's anybody's game.

[Woeler]

[quote="TheLionPrince"]
[quote="Woeler1"][quote="TheLionPrince"]gay marriage[/quote]
I don't even see what or who gives politicians (or anyone else) the right to deny gay people love, happiness and marriage. We're not living in the 14th century anymore. I can see how people can be against abortion, and maybe euthanasia, but this is just plain discrimination.[/quote]

I said it before, and I'll say it again. 30 out of 50 states in the U.S. turned it down, voted on by politicians gays and gay marriage-supporting heterosexuals voted into office. People turned out in droves in support of Chick-a-Fil, when various mayors were preventing their establishment in their respective cities.

But, if it makes you happy, Congress overturned the Defense of Marriage Act, and gays can serve openly in the army.
[/quote]
And that is just because homosexuality is far less common than heterosexuality. Person A can marry, while person B can't. That is discrimination. Are gays not equal to heterosexual people? Are they somehow less human? Do they deserve to have less rights? Being gay is NOT a choice!

This is exactly the same as when the black people were oppressed. They couldn't do certain things because they were black. Now those people can't do certain things because they are gay. It's not even a choice they made. Pure discrimination. All people are equal, no matter what race or sexuality or religion.
This is far from a developed society, this is state supported discrimination

[Azdgari]

Roight, let's see what I can give you here, LionPrince:

Tax reform: Firstly, the experts don't seem very keen on the feasibility of his tax plan. With tax rates for the wealthy the lowest they've generally been since WWII, you support bringing them even lower? Not at all a loaded question, do you think that they should be lower? How do you compensate for that with the deficit?

Oil expansion: I think I'm trying to support more green energy, so that's not a huge concern to me. I understand it has effects for the economy, but I think that drilling for more oil is destructive to the environment and thusly immoral. I don't have a particular problem with the Keystone, in fact I think it's one of the safer and less destructive bits (offshore drilling is just ludicrously unsafe--impossibly under regulated with regard to safety inspections and upkeep)

less goverment regulation of the economy: Yikes, isn't that how we got into this mess? Letting Wall Street do as it will? That hasn't exactly been doing a world of good for us. Or what economic regulation do you mean?

Trading policies: Don't know enough about it.

Gay marriage: Though I agree with Woeler, we shall agree to disagree. Your argument is one of the few rational ones, so I applaud you for that.

Support for Israel: I don't want to support Israel. The US practice of backing questionable governments because they want allies in certain regions wasn't good politics during the cold war and it isn't good now. Israel is as much an instigator in the middle east as any nation in the region. I believe It's irresponsible to support them.

Lower the national deficit: I'm with you there. Obama needs to get his head screwed on straight and make that a priority. It's one of his big flaws in my eyes.

[TheLionPrince]

[quote="Azdgari"]Oil expansion: I think I'm trying to support more green energy, so that's not a huge concern to me. I understand it has effects for the economy, but I think that drilling for more oil is destructive to the environment and thusly immoral. I don't have a particular problem with the Keystone, in fact I think it's one of the safer and less destructive bits (offshore drilling is just ludicrously unsafe--impossibly under regulated with regard to safety inspections and upkeep)[/quote]

As much I want more green energy to preserve the environment, but where were you when Solyndra and Konarka, solar energy companies the Obama administration supported, filed Chapter 7 Bankrupty?

Plus, isn't solar energy expensive to install?

[quote="Azdgari"]less goverment regulation of the economy: Yikes, isn't that how we got into this mess? Letting Wall Street do as it will? That hasn't exactly been doing a world of good for us. Or what economic regulation do you mean?[/quote]

The facts indicate otherwise. During the Bush administration, goverment regulation of the economy actually increased. According to this website, between fiscal year 2001 and fiscal year 2009, regulatory spending, adjusted for inflation, increased from $26.4 billion to an estimated $42.7 billion, or 62%.

In fact, the article argues that President Bush was the biggest regulator since President Nixon, and the economy under Nixon was terrible: high unemployment, declining value of the U.S. dollar (which is why he got us off the gold standard), and hyperinflation.

[quote="Azdgari"]Gay marriage: Though I agree with Woeler, we shall agree to disagree. Your argument is one of the few rational ones, so I applaud you for that.[/quote]

Why! Thank you!

[Woeler]

[quote="TheLionPrince"]
In fact, the article argues that President Bush was the biggest regulator since President Nixon, and the economy under Nixon was terrible: high unemployment, declining value of the U.S. dollar (which is why he got us off the gold standard), and hyperinflation.
[/quote]

... and he increased the state debt with $3.100.000.000.000 (Three point one trillion!) with one single war which sent the economy off Niagara falls...

He killed the economy according to
This
This
This
This
And This