Justin Bieber/Rebecca Black

[Gemini]

LOL well, all hardcore Bieber fans blame all his bad actions on ''stress'' or use the excuse that he is ''just a boy'' still, while one can be pretty sure that he has complete control over his actions...

Yeah, to be honest, I still kind of think of him as the 15-year-old he was in like 2009 (probably because he still sounds/looks like it, kinda)... but then I realize that he's, what, 20 now? I think you should claim responsibility for your actions at that point. Plus that's really no excuse, plenty of child stars have gone through that 'stress', I'm sure, but it's not like you see people such as, say, Jennifer Lawrence going all 'omg im so famous!!1! ima do what i want now!! kthxbai'. Just as an example.

Ah yes, I have seen that video. Everytime that girl refers to him as "the King of Pop" I internally cringe.
Michael Jackson>>>>>Justin Bieber

^ This comment.

Justin Bieber's music is pretty generic and average. There's nothing special about it at all. I don't feel anything when I listen to it.

The way I see it, he's become a pretty terrible person. There's no use blaming someone's actions on all the hate they get because

A) Negative attention is a given when you are famous, especially given this digital generation with twitter and facebook and stuff

B) Plenty of famous people have dealt with tons and tons of "hate" against them. Michael Jackson, for example, was widely referred to as a pedophile for the last twenty years of his life but never peed in buckets or drove drunk or made racial remarks.


Had Bieber made maybe one mistake I'd be like "okay, he's a teenager, he's growing up, he's making mistakes, we all do", but it's the fact that he's doing it over and over and over again and not giving a hoot about it or anyone else.


1) Making racist jokes - the counter argument for these videos seem to be that "he was only fourteen leave him allonnneee!!!1!11" At fourteen I had the sense to know that racism is disgusting, and racist jokes and using the "n word" are down right disgusting.

2) Disrespecting the lawyer in his deposition - It came across that he was being douchey just for the sake of being douchey.

3) Driving Drunk - Driving drunk is just damn-right selfish. Simple as that. I couldn't believe his fans were actually trying to defend him for this!

4) Spitting on fans

5) Pissing in buckets

The list goes on.

Some of the fans (SOME. I'm not saying ALL.) can be down-right silly, too, when it comes to King Bieber. I remember a few years ago on twitter "#cutforbieber" was trending because he had been smoking marijuana, half the pictures posted were fake and taken from google images, but the other half were very real. I found it incredibly offensive that people would A) just so light-heartedly decide to start self harming and B) Use images of someone else's to try and bring attention to themselves.


tL;dR - Bieber's music is nothing special, but he is a total Ass.

No one gets as much hate as he does, he has had people throwing homophobic comment him, has been the butt of many jokes and receives bullying on a daily basis, the haters always deny that they aren't to blame, when they pretty much are, he got famous too quick, the haters bullied him into depression and Selena kept shading him and playing mind tricks on him so she also helped ruin him.

1. He NEVER spat on fans, it was a picture shopped together with him spitting off of a balcony into bushes, the pic of "crying fans" has been around long before that pic came about.
2. The lawyer was being disrespectful of his privacy and asking him irrelevant questions, he was right to defend his privacy.
3. http://www.tmz.com/2014/01/28/justin-bi ... most-zero/ though, he still had alcohol in his system, he shouldn't have driven.

The thing is, you haters know absolutely NOTHING about him, you think you do, through all the lies and bull the media tells you, you just feel you have the right to spread hatred about someone and you feel your "opinions" stand, when calling someone "gay" and "talentless" is ironic, when the majority of his haters are still in school or gamers. Justin has always been disrespected by people for no reason, he worked hard to get where he is and now, you haters are whining he's "disrespectful"? Yes, he has done some pretty dumb things, but, bullying someone for their looks (I mean his facial features, late blooming and such things, which he can't help), the music they produce and calling someone something their not makes you no better than Justin with his disrespectful outbursts.

The haters have been waiting to see him mess up and they finally got their wish, though, he is still slaying so yeah, once again, Justin wins.

So here you go with this argument again, to which I say that you seem to have some misconceptions about what defines hate. While I will admit that some of the things people (particularly on Youtube - his name is pretty much synonymous with 'terrible' there) have said are a little over the top and senseless, and a lot of people just kind of hate him without knowing anything about him, you have to realize that there are plenty of people who don't like him for an actual reason. There's a difference between 'omg, that bieber prick is so gay, when's he gonna hit puberty?? i f-n hate him, he sounds like a little girl!' and 'this guy has really terrible music and he's been acting like a total d-bag lately, he's starting to get on my nerves!' Most, if not all of the responses in this thread have been of the second kind - I'm pretty sure that nobody here is hating him 'just because', or because they think he's a homosexual (personally, I think that's a silly reason not to like someone, but moving on).

Also, there is a huge, huge difference between someone not liking your art, and not liking you as a person (although I think, at this point, he has left himself open to both). As someone who writes and makes art myself, I know this difference. Trust me, you get criticism - whether or not you take it personally is up to you, but the fact is most sensible people don't get angry over it. Honestly. It's really not worth losing your sh*t over. Justin Bieber did get a lot of criticism when he started, but the fact is, as I said, a lot of the so-called 'haters' probably just didn't like his music (likely for an actual reason - for example, many people, myself included, just aren't big fans of modern pop in general). Most people didn't have a problem with JB as a person, I don't think, until they saw some of the things he did. And I don't think there were any haters sitting behind their computer saying "Gee, I really hope this Bieber kid ends up like another child star gone wrong!! That'd be really great!" So again, he kind of brought it on himself. He can either try to move on and be the better person, or he can keep doing what he's doing. So far, it looks like he's choosing the second option. Ultimately, he's in control of it; I don't see anyone coercing him into acting this way.

Oh, and another thing - popular =/= good in every instance. So just because he's 'successful' (eg, has a lot of fans and money and whatever), doesn't guarantee that he's a good artist.

Overall, I kind of have to agree with Niña here. I am not familiar with a lot of pop culture icons, as I have stressed numerous times, but I trust that she knows what she is talking about, and what she says does make a lot of sense. And lastly, if I am to believe that his fandom actually began self-harming to draw attention to JB, then... I don't really know what to say to that. It's really disrespectful to people who actually go through that, for reasons a lot more painful and relevant than some celebrity who honestly probably doesn't even really care about them. Granted, I don't know him as a person, but from my observation JB, and in fact many of these celebrities, don't seem like the type to get 'depressed' - I find your claim that he is very dubious - but rather more like the types that drive other people into depression in the first place. That said, though, hearing stuff like this is... really sending the wrong message about people who actually have faced depression or anything similar.

[Luigi Severus]

LOL well, all hardcore Bieber fans blame all his bad actions on ''stress'' or use the excuse that he is ''just a boy'' still, while one can be pretty sure that he has complete control over his actions...

Yeah, to be honest, I still kind of think of him as the 15-year-old he was in like 2009 (probably because he still sounds/looks like it, kinda)... but then I realize that he's, what, 20 now? I think you should claim responsibility for your actions at that point. Plus that's really no excuse, plenty of child stars have gone through that 'stress', I'm sure, but it's not like you see people such as, say, Jennifer Lawrence going all 'omg im so famous!!1! ima do what i want now!! kthxbai'. Just as an example.

Ah yes, I have seen that video. Everytime that girl refers to him as "the King of Pop" I internally cringe.
Michael Jackson>>>>>Justin Bieber

^ This comment.

Justin Bieber's music is pretty generic and average. There's nothing special about it at all. I don't feel anything when I listen to it.

The way I see it, he's become a pretty terrible person. There's no use blaming someone's actions on all the hate they get because

A) Negative attention is a given when you are famous, especially given this digital generation with twitter and facebook and stuff

B) Plenty of famous people have dealt with tons and tons of "hate" against them. Michael Jackson, for example, was widely referred to as a pedophile for the last twenty years of his life but never peed in buckets or drove drunk or made racial remarks.


Had Bieber made maybe one mistake I'd be like "okay, he's a teenager, he's growing up, he's making mistakes, we all do", but it's the fact that he's doing it over and over and over again and not giving a hoot about it or anyone else.


1) Making racist jokes - the counter argument for these videos seem to be that "he was only fourteen leave him allonnneee!!!1!11" At fourteen I had the sense to know that racism is disgusting, and racist jokes and using the "n word" are down right disgusting.

2) Disrespecting the lawyer in his deposition - It came across that he was being douchey just for the sake of being douchey.

3) Driving Drunk - Driving drunk is just damn-right selfish. Simple as that. I couldn't believe his fans were actually trying to defend him for this!

4) Spitting on fans

5) Pissing in buckets

The list goes on.

Some of the fans (SOME. I'm not saying ALL.) can be down-right silly, too, when it comes to King Bieber. I remember a few years ago on twitter "#cutforbieber" was trending because he had been smoking marijuana, half the pictures posted were fake and taken from google images, but the other half were very real. I found it incredibly offensive that people would A) just so light-heartedly decide to start self harming and B) Use images of someone else's to try and bring attention to themselves.


tL;dR - Bieber's music is nothing special, but he is a total Ass.

No one gets as much hate as he does, he has had people throwing homophobic comment him, has been the butt of many jokes and receives bullying on a daily basis, the haters always deny that they aren't to blame, when they pretty much are, he got famous too quick, the haters bullied him into depression and Selena kept shading him and playing mind tricks on him so she also helped ruin him.

1. He NEVER spat on fans, it was a picture shopped together with him spitting off of a balcony into bushes, the pic of "crying fans" has been around long before that pic came about.
2. The lawyer was being disrespectful of his privacy and asking him irrelevant questions, he was right to defend his privacy.
3. http://www.tmz.com/2014/01/28/justin-bi ... most-zero/ though, he still had alcohol in his system, he shouldn't have driven.

The thing is, you haters know absolutely NOTHING about him, you think you do, through all the lies and bull the media tells you, you just feel you have the right to spread hatred about someone and you feel your "opinions" stand, when calling someone "gay" and "talentless" is ironic, when the majority of his haters are still in school or gamers. Justin has always been disrespected by people for no reason, he worked hard to get where he is and now, you haters are whining he's "disrespectful"? Yes, he has done some pretty dumb things, but, bullying someone for their looks (I mean his facial features, late blooming and such things, which he can't help), the music they produce and calling someone something their not makes you no better than Justin with his disrespectful outbursts.

The haters have been waiting to see him mess up and they finally got their wish, though, he is still slaying so yeah, once again, Justin wins.

So here you go with this argument again, to which I say that you seem to have some misconceptions about what defines hate. While I will admit that some of the things people (particularly on Youtube - his name is pretty much synonymous with 'terrible' there) have said are a little over the top and senseless, and a lot of people just kind of hate him without knowing anything about him, you have to realize that there are plenty of people who don't like him for an actual reason. There's a difference between 'omg, that bieber prick is so gay, when's he gonna hit puberty?? i f-n hate him, he sounds like a little girl!' and 'this guy has really terrible music and he's been acting like a total d-bag lately, he's starting to get on my nerves!' Most, if not all of the responses in this thread have been of the second kind - I'm pretty sure that nobody here is hating him 'just because', or because they think he's a homosexual (personally, I think that's a silly reason not to like someone, but moving on).

Also, there is a huge, huge difference between someone not liking your art, and not liking you as a person (although I think, at this point, he has left himself open to both). As someone who writes and makes art myself, I know this difference. Trust me, you get criticism - whether or not you take it personally is up to you, but the fact is most sensible people don't get angry over it. Honestly. It's really not worth losing your sh*t over. Justin Bieber did get a lot of criticism when he started, but the fact is, as I said, a lot of the so-called 'haters' probably just didn't like his music (likely for an actual reason - for example, many people, myself included, just aren't big fans of modern pop in general). Most people didn't have a problem with JB as a person, I don't think, until they saw some of the things he did. And I don't think there were any haters sitting behind their computer saying "Gee, I really hope this Bieber kid ends up like another child star gone wrong!! That'd be really great!" So again, he kind of brought it on himself. He can either try to move on and be the better person, or he can keep doing what he's doing. So far, it looks like he's choosing the second option. Ultimately, he's in control of it; I don't see anyone coercing him into acting this way.

Oh, and another thing - popular =/= good in every instance. So just because he's 'successful' (eg, has a lot of fans and money and whatever), doesn't guarantee that he's a good artist.

Overall, I kind of have to agree with Niña here. I am not familiar with a lot of pop culture icons, as I have stressed numerous times, but I trust that she knows what she is talking about, and what she says does make a lot of sense. And lastly, if I am to believe that his fandom actually began self-harming to draw attention to JB, then... I don't really know what to say to that. It's really disrespectful to people who actually go through that, for reasons a lot more painful and relevant than some celebrity who honestly probably doesn't even really care about them. Granted, I don't know him as a person, but from my observation JB, and in fact many of these celebrities, don't seem like the type to get 'depressed' - I find your claim that he is very dubious - but rather more like the types that drive other people into depression in the first place. That said, though, hearing stuff like this is... really sending the wrong message about people who actually have faced depression or anything similar.

You have quite a few truths here, I can agree with you, bullying changes a person, no matter who they are, it has changed Justin greatly. The "his music is terrible" is another illogical reason to "hate" him, because in reality, most of the people that say that are just hopping on the anti-Bieber bandwagon to fit in and look "cool", there are some people who state that they don't like his music, and they usually aren't an ass about it and say "This kid has loads of talent, however, I can't stand his music", because in reality, Justin DOES have talent and he can't be "talentless" because he wouldn't have the success he has today. Because calling Justin "talentless" is like saying birds and trees don't exist, when in reality, they do. And, Justin uploaded videos of himself singing on YouTube, playing various instruments and he has written songs.

And I'm sorry, if you still think Justin looks and sounds like he did when he was 15, then there you must be living under a rock.

[FlipMode]

calling someone "gay" and "talentless" is ironic, when the majority of his haters are still in school or gamers.

Because all gamers and anyone in school are all extremely gay and talentless.
It's hard to take you seriously when you suddenly start saying rubbish like that mid post.

Also just because someone doesn't put "IMO" at the end of every post, doesn't mean it's not their opinion.

My opinion on the topic? I wouldn't say he is talentless but I will say his generic pop isn't for me. Also the guy himself is an ass. Doesn't matter if there's some deep reason for what it, let's just call a spade a spade because at the end of the day it's still his choice.

[Luigi Severus]

calling someone "gay" and "talentless" is ironic, when the majority of his haters are still in school or gamers.

Because all gamers and anyone in school are all extremely gay and talentless.
It's hard to take you seriously when you suddenly start saying rubbish like that mid post.

Also just because someone doesn't put "IMO" at the end of every post, doesn't mean it's not their opinion.

My opinion on the topic? I wouldn't say he is talentless but I will say his generic pop isn't for me. Also the guy himself is an ass. Doesn't matter if there's some deep reason for what it, let's just call a spade a spade because at the end of the day it's still his choice.

What I mean its that the haters really do nothing impressive, all they do is play video games, watch anime and stalk him and his fans, the younger ones also go to school. Calling someone "gay", "talentless" and saying someone "looks like a girl" isn't an opinion, it's bullying.

And, you do have a logical opinion "I wouldn't say he is talentless but I will say his generic pop isn't for me" it is short and sweet.

Bullying does get to people someway or another, they can either do or say something about it OR, they can succumb to it, Justin doing the latter, due to him most likely being unable to speak for himself and defend himself.

[Gemini]

And I'm sorry, if you still think Justin looks and sounds like he did when he was 15, then there you must be living under a rock.

Well, I don't really keep up with these things. I know he's gotten his haircut changed and is wearing tattoos (?), but he still has the same kind of 'teenage dreamboat' persona going on, or something... I know tons of teenagers across America still love him regardless. It's kind of the way he markets himself - I mean, he has his own brand of perfume and everything.

In short, he's a pop artist marketed to younger teen girls. That might be why so many people find it hard to take him seriously. If you look at some of his songs (or at least the ones I've heard), they only reinforce this image, as does the media. You can't really listen to a song like "As Long As You Love Me" without thinking that a lot of desperate, love-struck young girls are going to be wishing that he was singing it to them. That was probably the intent.

So yes, in my mind's eye I still see him as the same boyish persona that he was in 2009.

Also, just reading this now, we're all kind of posting at the same time, but... why don't you think he can defend himself, if he really feels as threatened by it as you say he does? It's not like he doesn't have access to the press, or the opportunity to make a big deal out of it.

Just asking.

[Luigi Severus]

And I'm sorry, if you still think Justin looks and sounds like he did when he was 15, then there you must be living under a rock.

Well, I don't really keep up with these things. I know he's gotten his haircut changed and is wearing tattoos (?), but he still has the same kind of 'teenage dreamboat' persona going on, or something... I know tons of teenagers across America still love him regardless. It's kind of the way he markets himself - I mean, he has his own brand of perfume and everything.

In short, he's a pop artist marketed to younger teen girls. That might be why so many people find it hard to take him seriously. If you look at some of his songs (or at least the ones I've heard), they only reinforce this image, as does the media. You can't really listen to a song like "As Long As You Love Me" without thinking that a lot of desperate, love-struck young girls are going to be wishing that he was singing it to them. That was probably the intent.

So yes, in my mind's eye I still see him as the same boyish persona that he was in 2009.

Also, just reading this now, we're all kind of posting at the same time, but... why don't you think he can defend himself, if he really feels as threatened by it as you say he does? It's not like he doesn't have access to the press, or the opportunity to make a big deal out of it.

Just asking.

Have you listened to his newer music? It's much more different now and quite mature, he has converted a lot of people who hated him for illogical, dumb reasons just to look cool to actually taking him seriously, he's also dropped the whole teen idol look, he is trying to have a R&B style in music.

I think he is told by his manager how to react to the incessant and pathetic hate he gets and to the rumors and truths the media talk about, it's probably: "don't give them the attention they crave Justin, they are only trying to ruin your image". He wouldn't have as much haters and criticism by the media if he defended and spoke up about himself and things like that.

[Ninaroja]

No one gets as much hate as he does

There are PLENTY of famous people that have been given labels that they can't shake off no matter what they do in their careers or what they do as people.

For example:

-Sarah Jessica Parker: Widely referred to as "ugly" and "looks like a horse"
-Michael Jackson: Labelled as a Pedophile and a Kiddy Fiddler
- Miley Cyrus: [censored], [censored] etc.
- Mel Gibson: Racist, Anti-semetic, woman beater
- Amy Whinehouse: Drunk, druggie, alcoholic, crazy
- Chris Brown: Woman beater
- Paris Hilton: Blonde, Bimbo, stupid, [censored], [censored]
- Jonas Brothers: Prudes, Gay, Bible-Bashers
- Charlie Sheen: Drug Addict, Maniac
- Adele: Fat
- One Direction: Gay
- Demi Lovato: Cutter, crazy, emo

receives bullying on a daily basis

So does any famous person with a twitter account

the haters always deny that they aren't to blame

So they're saying they are to blame What's your point?


The fact that you are suggesting correlation between gamers and anime fans and people who don't like Justin Bieber makes you look very very ignorant. I could make plenty of generalisations about you as a Bieber fan. I could say stuff like "unintelligent, disrespectful, crazy" etc. but I'm not going to because I know better than to insult people I don't know on the internet.

The thing is, you haters know absolutely NOTHING about him, you think you do, through all the lies and bull the media tells you, you just feel you have the right to spread hatred about someone and you feel your "opinions" stand, when calling someone "gay" and "talentless" is ironic, when the majority of his haters are still in school or gamers. Justin has always been disrespected by people for no reason, he worked hard to get where he is and now, you haters are whining he's "disrespectful"? Yes, he has done some pretty dumb things, but, bullying someone for their looks (I mean his facial features, late blooming and such things, which he can't help), the music they produce and calling someone something their not makes you no better than Justin with his disrespectful outbursts.

1. Au Contraire, it seems that we seem to actually know quite a lot about him, or at least enough to know that he's a terrible person

2. Why is "opinions" in inverted commas. They are our opinions, there's no doubt that we have them or that they exist.

3. No-one in this current argument has called him "gay" or a "girl" or "talentless". No one has made fun of his looks. We've all expressed or dislike of him as a person for doing what he's done and his lousy generic music that sounds exactly the same as all that electronic pop-garbage on the radio right now.

4. Actually, I am a much better person than Justin Bieber. I don't act childish towards my elders and betters just because I think I'm smarter or in a bad mood ("This is a film?"). I don't get drunk or high and then swagger over to my car and start driving it because I know that that is stupid and dangerous and incredibly incredibly selfish. I don't piss in buckets or swear at pictures of politicians or make racist jokes or use racial slurs. I don't egg people's houses for fun. I don't write my initials in piss in the snow. I don't graffiti hotel rooms, and I don't abandon the pets I love and care for.


Everyone on this thread, including you, has the right to express their opinion regardless of what it is. You, however, are the only one who has been rude and attacking people just because they don't agree with you.

I invite you to be less narrow-minded about other people whether they play video games or watch anime or like different music to you. Every artist puts out their craft with the intention of people seeing/hearing it and forming an opinion about it. The fact that Justin Bieber and his team choose to put out generic and boring pop music is nothing to do with any of us and not our fault.

I also invite you to try out some of the musicians I like, and then pass a judgement on me. I like bands like Coldplay, Imagine Dragons, Oasis and U2. I like their songs for their use of instruments, their creative lyrics and variation between songs. When I listen to their music I actually feel something (which for some reason I can't when a song's entire chorus is mainly "baby" over and over again)

And as for "his songs are more mature and sexual now", I think you just contradicted yourself in that sentence...





EDIT: I just looked at your profile. It says you are a 19 year old male. At this point you are either a troll, the second of which to hit negative pride points, or you are just a guy who really likes Justin Bieber. Nothing wrong with that, just a little unorthodox.

[Luigi Severus]

I also invite you to try out some of the musicians I like, and then pass a judgement on me. I like bands like Coldplay, Imagine Dragons, Oasis and U2. I like their songs for their use of instruments, their creative lyrics and variation between songs. When I listen to their music I actually feel something (which for some reason I can't when a song's entire chorus is mainly "baby" over and over again)

"Baby", is that the ONLY song you can come up with? Oh my gosh... He DOES have other songs...

[Ninaroja]

I know that. That was just an EXAMPLE. It doesn't matter though. Anyone who puts out an entertainment product becomes a BRAND. I have every right to not like Justin Bieber or his music in the same way I don't have to like heavy metal or Michael Bay films.

[Tsuki]

I also invite you to try out some of the musicians I like, and then pass a judgement on me. I like bands like Coldplay, Imagine Dragons, Oasis and U2. I like their songs for their use of instruments, their creative lyrics and variation between songs. When I listen to their music I actually feel something (which for some reason I can't when a song's entire chorus is mainly "baby" over and over again)

"Baby", is that the ONLY song you can come up with? Oh my gosh... He DOES have other songs...

And this is all you can come back with? LOL!!

Guys don't feed the troll. HE is not worth it.