Timon and Ma

[Timon the great]

Well I've been meaning to start this topic for several months now. And if I don't post it now, then I'll be stuck messing with it in my drafts for another month or more. But, TLK 1 1/2 or 3 definitely wouldn't be TLK 1 1/2, without also having a discussion on Timon and his Mother's relationship from this film.

I know that this is something that from what I've seen out there has been pushed aside at least some on this TLK film. It may be because of the view that Ma "had to be" in it in order for Timon's back story in the beginning to coincide. But the entire film doesn't show that. And instead, it really shows that care was put into crafting this idea for the movie and is definitely within in the bounds of TLK culture. I would also say that it's something to the extent of Simba's relationship with his father Mufasa in TLK 1.

Why else did they bring Ma back into picture in the middle (with Rafiki) and then in the ending parts of the movie? Not only that. The deleted scenes also show that Timon had a much better relationship with his mother than with his deleted father, while he was growing up and being frowned upon in his meerkat colony.

As I've written in this topic, I do like Timon's relationship with Ma more than Timon & Pumbaa. One main reason why is because there is a good deal of feeling involved between them and not just full blown laughter. I'm not saying Timon's friendship with Pumbaa is meaningless, especially in this film, where their developing friendship had some depth in it as well. But one example for Timon & Ma is in this scene.

I do of course, like that there is definitely comedy mixed in with them as well as it happily can't be avoided with Timon. But what makes it more unique to me, is how it is mixed in with the depth that is shown in the scenes like the one linked above between him & Ma. So instead of it just being plain funny, the creators actually took some time (although slightly rushed) to blend it in meaningfully.

When you have seen this entire film, it becomes very obvious that Timon loves his mom just as much as Ma loves her son in this film. And it really shows for Timon when he brings her to their new predator-free home near the end of the film. I will never forget that quote in this part where he tells her: "I found a place that was beyond my wildest dreams. But..., it still wasn't home." I very honestly see that as an act of love from him. 'Least to me, it's a very unexpectedly good and comforting quote to hear him say in his film.

All of this, while also very unexpected for me when I first watched the entire movie, even tells me that Timon has appreciation for his mother in his life. Even more, their relationship has helped me to appreciate my own mom more in my life too. It really has helped, and even to understand more about the importance of parents in a person's life and the love that comes out of it.

He may be most known for his wisecracking and sarcastic behavior overall. But had it not been for Ma, I definitely would have not understood where Timon's own (maybe sometimes hidden) sensitive side comes from. And this is one of the reasons why I love seeing him the most in this film, out of all official works. Because this whole part of the film shows that he really does go the extra mile in TLK 1 1/2.

I could go on and on this subject for paragraphs. But if you've read this far, then I thank you for doing so. Yet, I definitely want to see what everyone thinks about this in what is actually a good TLK 1.5 discussion to have on.

Oh. And be sure to take a look at this please :

[Zonofon]

I can agree that in TLK 3 Timon looks most like personage with its own character. And it is largely due to his relationships with his mother. This sense creates volatility of these relationships (with side of Timon). For me they look like attacks of tenderness, especially in moments of reflection and sadness. At the end of this scene Timon quite simply go away (without some pity). But it is only visible side- I think at heart he always love Ma. How can he not love a person who does not prevent to get better and lets go on a long journey, knowing that she will worry about him?
What about mom- she always ready to support Timon and love him for who he is.

[cleargreenwater]

I freakin' love Timon & Ma.

Especially the "What? ...WHAT? GOOD BYE, Ma!"

My mother and I do that to each other all the time in real life, *right* there with Timon in totally understanding that.

I think their relationship is great, and wholly welcome Ma as a legitimate TLK universe character. Her & Uncle Max gel perfectly with the art and characterization style and development level of the first film. She's as loving as Mufasa & Sarabi, but without the omniscient wisdom and a lot more practicality, along with a good bit of her own big personality in a little critter and can definitely see where Timon gets his quick uptake from!

[TheLionPrince]

I can agree the mother-son relationship between Timon and Ma is one of the more overlooked and under-appreciated aspects of the film, and successfully follows the child-parent relationship tropes in the first two movies: the father-son relationship in TLK and the father-daughter relationship in Simba's Pride.

And while Timon does gain a more humane side of his personality in this film, I can't help but feel there were brief glimpses of his personality outside of his renown wise-cracking, sarcastic behavior. In The Lion King, it's shown he likes to keep the things he treasures in life very close with him, and hates to see it leave him as seen when he grows envious when Nala woos Simba away from him and Pumbaa. This is carried over 1½ when he initially refuses to leave the jungle to help Simba because he's grown attached to it for some years. In Simba's Pride, he is pretty nostalgic of the past as he tries to recreate the relationship he and Pumbaa had with Simba on Kiara. Oddly enough, it tied in with the theme of "putting the past behind us".

And I can't be the only one that admires the hair gags Ma does with Timon, and how it resolves after the climax? Besides that, the art design and the characterizations of the original and new characters compliment the first movie to my satisfaction.

[Timon the great]

While I do agree with most (if not all) of what was said in the replies, for Timon, these scenes of him and Ma mean a lot to me. They are important to see because they elevate him in several ways that cannot be seen in the previous TLK films. But that's completely understandable because TLK 1 and 2 were not about him. So the creators of those films pretty much could only resort to the basic personality values of a wisecracking, laughable meerkat.

But here in TLK 3, this is the real deal for Timon. And so a deeper understanding of the reality of himself was really needed in order to prove that in the long run, he Is a good character with good intentions. This is why (despite what others have negatively said about this film because it wasn't about the lions), this film was still important on the face of TLK. Without this film, I would have never seen him And TLK anymore positively different than from what I had been seeing from the previous films. Timon away from Ma and/or TLK 3; there was just no real loving aspect to be seen from him.

[quote="TheLionPrince"]And I can't be the only one that admires the hair gags Ma does with Timon, and how it resolves after the climax?[/quote]
Of course you're not. I think it's funny all around too. Although I think Ma doing it in this scene only irritated her son and didn't help his situation. So it really wasn't considered funny in that part. It was actually more of a "need to be serious" type scenario because Timon already knew staying any much longer in the colony wasn't going to work. This even goes to show that this film has a little bit of drama to it. Ma was trying to tell him otherwise, only to realize that she can't hold her son deep in her hands forever.

What's also interesting about this concerning the climax is that, Ma "learns" in the end to be a more open mother to Timon. That is, letting him freely shine and be able to breathe completely on his own in which he does. But, after Timon realizes that he can't truly and morally enjoy life without his friends and family, it seems that this helped in connecting the pieces in him lovingly wanting to bring his mother to their promised land. This just gives such a different face of Timon that not even this text can fully explain how I feel when I watch those scenes, and especially this part. It is truly good.

[Timon the great]

Bumping the topic up to let others know about its presence since it was removed during the sub forum clean out.

[ScarLoyal]

I agree. We defiantly see that Timon and Ma's relationship is a strong one.

[Timon8]

Yes, it's great! Altough I prefer his bond with Pumbaa more.

[Timon the great]

What I would also like to add to this topic is that I've read from others on this forum who've said that Ma is being "just" motherly to Timon, in which I don't necessarily have anything against that. But at the same time, I don't find that she is being just that because this is Timon's mother.

On the contrary, from everything I've seen from Ma on this film, she ultimately loves her son Timon unconditionally and so does he. It's easy to see that they accept each other very well and also in the sense that Ma is actually the one who has always been there for Timon since the beginning.

At the beginning of the film, even though Ma may not fully understand at first exactly why Timon wants to leave his colony and find a new home of his own and eventually for her and his colony, she realizes that she can't hold onto Timon so tightly that he cannot "breathe" on his own.

And so in short, how does this resolve between them near the end of the film at this scene?

Ma asks Timon if he has found what he was looking for in his life. And to see that she would ask him about this (Timon himself appears a little surprised at this too when she does), shows me that she loves him for who he is, unconditionally and outwardly cares about his own well-being.

Not just because this is her own child/son.

[MeerkatOnTheMoon]

I just finished a Power Point presentation on meerkats for my Animals As Media class and wrote about Timon in TLK 1 1/2. Saw the movie again, and I agree with everyone on the special bond between Timon and Ma. He definitely goes the extra mile here especially with the courage to dream of a better home for her and his fellow meerkats.