My Lion King Forum

This might have been addressed before, but one thing about TLK SP that has bothered me is that Kovu should have taken a bit longer to turn away from his mission to kill Simba. I always wondered why Zira wouldn't order Vitani or Kovu to kill Kiara as well to wipe out Simba's line to really reclaim Scar's throne. I'm not saying Kovu was inherently evil just that Zira saw him that way and as Scar's heir. He grew up in hatred trained to kill and hate Pridelanders. Vitani wasn't evil either, but she was brainwashed in the same taint. They grew up thinking they were justified. I understand the real reasons this didn't happen was time constraints. I wish Sarabi had been in the film (I know her voice actress passed on) but Kovu could really get a sense of the damage Scar did versus what he'd been told really happened.

I guess I equate it with someone raised in a cult in that it takes a lot of coaxing for them to see the turn behind what they were raised to believe. Kiara would help, but Kovu would have to see that she is not horrible like Zira makes her out to be either.

Growing up I always assumed that there was an implied passage of time, several days or weeks or so, between the fire rescue and "Upendi." So I always found it weird that people think his change of heart was too fast. I mean yeah, the movie doesn't show that time, but we aren't shown the time between their cubhood and Kiara's hunt either. So I just kind of always figured there was a shorter time skip in there that explained it.

I feel showing that time skip would have made the movie stronger, in my opinion. It's too jarring with the way it's presented. I'm not saying they had to dedicate a huge chunk of the running time to it or anything. But a little more fleshing out of his change of his heart would have been better.

To me, Vitani being angry at Kovu not having completed his mission makes it seem as though Kovu had only been there a couple days. Which, I agree, is too fast of a turn. A time skip wouldn't be that hard to show. Beauty and the Beast was so great because a quick montage turned it into a romance that actually took a while to build. I'm not sure how they could work in the other Outsiders being eager to take over, but I'd wager they could have come up with something.

[quote="Squeely"]To me, Vitani being angry at Kovu not having completed his mission makes it seem as though Kovu had only been there a couple days. [/quote]
That always implied the opposite to me. The plan was for Kovu to get close to Kiara and then kill Simba. In order for Vitani to be so angry about it (and Zira as well), it seems to me it would have had to have been much longer than just a couple of days. If they thought he could become close friends with Kiara in a few days, that'd make them pretty stupid.

[quote="Carl Skywalker"]
That always implied the opposite to me. The plan was for Kovu to get close to Kiara and then kill Simba. In order for Vitani to be so angry about it (and Zira as well), it seems to me it would have had to have been much longer than just a couple of days. If they thought he could become close friends with Kiara in a few days, that'd make them pretty stupid.[/quote]
I don't think they cared that much about Kovu getting close to Kiara. I mean, he was just supposed to use her. As long as he was in good enough favor with her, everything was fine. It's possible they had already seen Kovu spending time with Kiara and thought "Part 1 is done enough".

You can't be in good favor with someone if you're still a practical stranger, though.

True, but Kiara always liked Kovu and wasn't acting like that much of a stranger towards him. It's possible the Outsiders noticed this, combined with Kovu not taking the opportunity at Simba that he had there...

I agree with Carl Skywalker, I believe that more time passed form the time Kovu was "conditionally" accepted into Simba's Pride to the time that Simba allowed Kovu to enter their den. Than what the movie actually showed. That makes much more sense.There is also the fact that despite Zira's obviously skillful brainwashing. Kovu's heart was still good at it's core. When all factors are taken into account, that is why turning good was not as difficult a derision for Kovu to make as some people might think.
Now what I though was dumb on Vitani's part was that she did not think everything through. If Kovu had attacked Simba at that moment, every lioness would have been on him in a matter of seconds (because it would not have been a challenge for The Throne, it would have been an assassination attempt). Even if Kovu was lucky enough to land a killing bite against Simba he would never have survived the wrath of the lionesses. I know that Zira considered Kovu to be an expendable asset, but I doubt her plan as she had originally intend was for Kovu to sacrifice himself to take out Simba.