Ajabu and Makucha

[gothprincesskiara]

ok I think there has been a bit of some confusion concerning the situation between Ajabu and Makucha, now I have been role playing into the episode after I saw it and I need some help on clearing up this confusion before I continue my RP, now according to my RP, someone has randomly volunteered to role play as Makucha for me and he says this in quote...

[quote]The so called "Lion Guard" had no right to interrupt between me and my prey! It was none of their business if I eat that Ajabu or not! Or what? You Pridelanders "respect" every animal so much that you never hunt one of them? I wonder how would you feel in my place? Chasing a precious prey then getting knocked aside by a bunch of teens! Even if it was your "territory" this Okapi was my prey and I have come a long way to get him! He didn't know about this place or the rules and neither did I! But if you pridelanders keep up this "respectful" manner then you and your family will bring shame on the predators![/quote]

he also said in Quoate after my response

[quote]"I know it is rare alright! And do you know why? Because it's very delicious! But it's Herd Is far away from your lands, Ajabu was lucky to find it. But me and my leap know exactly where the rest can be found! However us leopards, we choose our prey and then we stick with it until we get it! By the interrupt of your Lion Guard, your family has interrupted the Circle of Life! How about considering that?"[/quote]

now can we talk about this because this was exactly my thought and was confused about? how do we make this work when it comes to the law of the circle of life?

[Elton John]

The lion guard help create stability in the pridelands. Stability means you don't eat more than what is necessary, which is why most of the hyenas are not allowed as they kill for sport and not for survival.

I'm willing to bet that if Simba knew jasiri she would become an honorary member of the pridelands.

As for Makucha, he was an outsider hunting in pride rock. He's not a member of the pridelands. Why do you think they had to get Simba and Nalas permission for ajabu to live there? Do you really think Makucha would stop hunting in the pridelands after eating one okapi? He wouldn't.

A predator killing and eating more than his or her share would disrupt the balance of the circle of life.

[Troll Berserker]

Did you watch the episode carefuly? It is said that there are no leopards in pridelands and the gazelles (and probably other animals) don't know leopards at all so they aren't scared, which makes them a way too easy target.

And just like Elton John said, Ajabu had to ask permission to live in pridelands. Makucha arrived and started hunting without anyone's consent.

[Aelwen]

IRL leopards avoid lions, they are rivals and lions usually kill them.
In TLK I suppose most large predators are not allowed to live. Thus is basically hunting territory for the lion pride. Yes lions control it and try to support balance but it's only to keep the herds drom leaving.

[moonsugar33]

In the beginning I liked to believe that the Circle of Life encompassed all animals, but with the constant heckling of predator animals by The Lion Guard I'm starting to second guess that.

Okay, so here's my logical theory on it all: One particular family of lions discovered/understood that keeping balance and harmony within the ecosystem (developing a system of not overhunting, ensuring stable populations) worked out really well in not only their favour (a sustainable food supply) but in the favour of the other animals as well (peace of mind, and being able to stay in the one area and not have to panic and hide all the time for fear of being eaten like Ajabu). These lions stayed where they were and kept the system going under their moral code, the Circle of Life. The territory of these lions became the Pridelands.

Other regions, like Ajabu and Makucha's, might not have been so well-looked-after and suffered as a result. For example, Ajabu and Makucha's land, and the effect that Scar had on the Pridelands after he was in charge; he certainly didn't respect the Circle of Life, did he? You think he only took what he needed? No, he let the hyenas run loose, eating everything until there was nothing left.

The Pridelands is kind of like a farm, kind of. It's my belief that the prey animals there can live their lives safe and happy, knowing that they have no real reason to fear, as they are under the protection of the king's rule: no predator takes more than they need. In exchange for this, the sick/old/excess animals may be eaten. Predators that don't respect this balance/practice are not welcome in the Pridelands. (see: the crocodile leadership scuffle)

Simba and Nala were probably (as well as being proud of Kion for making friends) delighted to welcome Ajabu to the herd, as TB and EJ suggested, in the hopes of establishing a new population of Okapi. More food! Awesome!

To counter your roleplay partner, I'd suggest (obviously not in these words) "when in Rome, do as the Romans do". Not your territory? Not your rules.

[gothprincesskiara]

Thank you, Moonsuqar33

also I thought I posted it but I guess I didnt here is what i figured out

well I have watched it again and written down some notes to investigate more on the matter.
FIRST OFF, lets look at the 2 words RARE, SPECIES. and see what it means please read the information here at the link. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rare_species
Now keep that in mind while I explain the fallowing.....
Now going through the episode in order and going through all the notes I wrote down, and it all makes sense.
1. Ajabu is from a far away place. and he said where he is from, hiding is the best thing for an okapi to do, why? go to Question 2.
2.Ajabu says there arnt that many Okapi from where he is from, they are RARE! read that Rare species link again please then continue to #3. and where Ajabu is from, he says leopards have been hunting Okapis all the time, maybe too much to the point where they became RARE!
3. Okapis are a Jaguars favorite food, SO if they are rare then they may have been over hunted by the leopard(s). so now its harder for them to get Okapis and thats how they became rare from where Ajabu is from.
4. Makucha was FIRST SEEN HUNTING GAZELLES. So there was no ecuse for him to be hunting Ajabu if he was going to have Gazelle. but then the Lion Guard interrupted his hunt, moving on.
3. Maybe Beshte told the rest of the Guard the Okapis where rare and Kion made the assumption that, since the Okapi are rare, maybe Kion wanted to help his species by introducing the Okapi into the Pridelands to help repopulate the Okapis. TO do so he would let Ajabu stay safe in the Pridelands where his life would not be hunted by leopards. if Makucha hunted Ajabu, it would be a waste of an Okapi and the more endangered the Okapis become. So more might come into the Pridelands and repopulate.
4. Leopards dont always have to say hello with there teeth, Im sure most leopards know, the Circle of Life unlike Makucha who doesnt consider that the Okapis are rare and endangered.
5. Last note, Makucha did what was best for the Circle of Life, leave the Okopi alone and left to find more easier more populated prey.
I thought very hard through this in a biological point of you when it comes to endangered species, when it comes to endangered species you go from endangered to rare which is called the bottle neck effect. I learned this in Biology and zoology! So,when it comes to this episode it all fits, at least for me, I think they are setting a good example for children on keeping animals safe from EXTINCTION. and that is what im all about!
this is final! CASE CLOSED MOVING ON!

[Elton John]

moonsugar, have you forgotten that the royal lions believe that when they die they become food for zebras and gazelles and the like? It's not as cynical as you say.

Yes, the lion guard is about creating stability but if it's just about food then what about characters like zazu or timon and pumbaa? Why haven't they been eaten? because they are viewed as friends. Not something to be made a meal of.

With the blessing of the king Ajabu can live in the pridelands as a friend of the lions a la zazu/t&p.

It's about survival, but the mindset behind it is not as cruel as you say.

Simba could have easily eaten timon and pumbaa by now. He hasn't, because they are his friends and he is not a mindless creature.

Mufasa could have eaten zazu, or let scar make a meal out of him but he was more than just a majordomo he was mufasas friend.

Rafiki? Another friend to just about everyone.

The lions aren't running this for the benefit of themselves but for everyone.

[moonsugar33]

Oh! I'm sorry, I didn't mean to imply that the lions were cruel or self-serving. I did in fact consider Mufasa's line "When we die, our bodies become the grass, and the antelope eat the grass", but didn't think it necessary to include in my example because let's be honest, who could forget that scene

Of course the lions are intelligent and benevolent; I feel TLG has really amped up their anthro qualities and involvement with the rest of the animal kingdom, perhaps outside the scope of the original movies, but they are still obviously certainly intelligent enough to have friends, devise plots, blah blah- and most importantly, they lay down the law for the animal kingdom. You can't enforce laws without being bound by them yourself.

[Aelwen]

[quote]have you forgotten that the royal lions believe that when they die they become food for zebras and gazelles and the like? It's not as cynical as you say.[/quote]
Lions die rarely, zebras/wildbeasts are eaten often, maybe three-four times a week. But creators don't want children to think that lions are bad so we'll probably never see a real hunt of Nala/Simba/etc/

[Squeely]

[quote="Aelwen"][quote]have you forgotten that the royal lions believe that when they die they become food for zebras and gazelles and the like? It's not as cynical as you say.[/quote]
Lions die rarely, zebras/wildbeasts are eaten often, maybe three-four times a week. But creators don't want children to think that lions are bad so we'll probably never see a real hunt of Nala/Simba/etc/[/quote]
Didn't Kiara, Tiifu, and Zuri go hunting? They didn't kill anything, but they were practicing. Pretty sure Kion has mentioned his parents going hunting as well.

If anything, I think they'll refrain from showing much hunting because it's a show intended for young audiences. They want to keep violence out of it, at least violence as graphic as lions killing and eating an animal would be. But they are acknowledging that the lions hunt, at least.